[The following post is an interview with Kate Aly-Brady, Daniel Budiansky, Adam Lioz, and Rupa Mitra by Stephanie Jenkins about their article, “White Phragility.” The interview is part of an AMA series celebrating the publication of the “Phish and Philosophy” special issue of the Public Philosophy Journal (edited by Stephanie Jenkins and Charlie Dirksen). Kate, Daniel, Adam, and Rupa will also be answering your questions in the Comments throughout the week. Please note that the opinions expressed in blog posts on this site are not necessarily endorsed or shared by any of the volunteers who run Phish.net or The Mockingbird Foundation. This site and this blog rely entirely on the work of volunteers. -Ed.]

Tell us about yourselves? Who are you? When were your first shows? Why do you come back?

RM: My name is Rupa Mitra, and I was born in the US to parents of Bengali ethnic heritage. I grew up in the Northeast of the US but lived a third of my adult life abroad (mainly France and Tanzania). I’m a labor/human resources lawyer. My first show was in 2011. I had to take a hiatus when I gave birth as a solo parent in 2019 but hope to be bringing my little one to shows before long! Nothing can compare to the exuberance of a Phish show.

KAB: My name is Kate Aly-Brady, and I am a cisgender white female who grew up on the East Coast. I moved to the Pacific Northwest after college, and have been a special education teacher ever since. My first shows were in 1998, and I keep coming back because the music, the people, the energy are like home. I’m a part of Phans for Racial Equity (PHRE) because I want everyone to have the chance to feel at home there, too.

ARL: My name’s Adam Lioz and I’m a secular Jewish kid from Long Island who grew up seeing the Dead at Nassau Coliseum, MSG, and Giant’s stadium in the 90s. For my day job I work to promote inclusive, multiracial democracy (fighting to expand voting rights) as a lawyer and advocate. I saw a few shows in 1.0 and 2.0 (including Coventry), but I really got hooked in 2009 when I went to the Gorge and Festival 8. I keep coming back for the music, the community, and that decent chance each night to experience some pure joy and collective ecstatic release. I sometimes think these four guys run the most efficient joy factory I’ve ever seen.

DB: My name is Daniel Budiansky (.net: @climber17). I am a cisgender white male who grew up in the suburbs of Northern Virginia during the 80s. While my first show was 4/20/94, it wasn’t until my second show, when they played University Hall (at UVa, where I was a student) in late fall ‘94 that I “got IT”, during the first set "Maze"…it’s been a long, strange trip ever since. A Phish show will forever be my “home away from home.”

Why did you decide to write this essay? What do you want your readers to take away from it?

ARL: The essay is based on the online reactions to the "Phish Scene So White: Let’s Talk" blog post I wrote in 2017. To be honest I was pretty surprised and a bit taken back by the response – first that it went so viral, with thousands of comments, and then by the vitriol it inspired, both through those comments and through some pretty harsh direct messages to me. Of course, people looked me up and called me a tarper and that was fine, but I really didn’t anticipate how upset people got. But when I started to look at the response through the lens of DiAngelo’s white fragility framework it started to make a lot more sense. A big reason people were so angry and defensive is that we see ourselves as an inclusive, welcoming scene and my essay was a threat to that self-image. Once we started looking at the comments with DiAngelo’s lens it was pretty easy to start seeing a lot of the comments as examples of one or more of the elements of defensiveness and fragility.

Our goal was to encourage people to examine our scene a bit more closely and critically and think about whether we’re quite as inclusive as we think, and whether the kind of defensiveness that is the hallmark of white fragility might be a particular challenge for us moving forward. We also think we hit a neat extension of D’Angelo’s theory by distinguishing between “pillars” of white fragility (which are the false beliefs about race that lead to the fragility) and “manifestations” (which are the various ways that the resulting defensiveness plays out).

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[We would like to thank users Scissortail (Matt) and phorbin007 (Cody) for recapping last night's show. -Ed.]

We’d be remiss to recap the final night of Phish’s 2023 Mexico run without taking a moment to note the obvious: Phish Mexico is pure joy, plain and simple. There is absolutely nothing like it.

I know it’s not everyone’s cup of tea. I know it’s expensive. I know from countless .net threads exactly the kinds of vacations one could take for the same cost. But when it comes to Phish runs, this place is truly magical. If you like lounging in a pool with a cocktail in hand, making instant friends with every single person you meet, and ending each day with a concert on the beach by the greatest band in the history of the world—you just might like Phish Mexico.

Out of four shows this run, Friday night is a clear, undeniable standout. It’s firmly in the tier of Mexico classics like 2/25/22, 2/26/22, 2/22/20 and 1/15/17. It was the kind of show that makes you remember what Phish can do. And it was the kind of show that could make you scratch your chin and wonder: What gets into them on nights like that? Why can’t they do that all the time?

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[Phish.net would like to offer a super freaky congratulations to our recapper, ZZYZX, who attended his 400th Phish show last night! -Ed.]

One of the advantages of being new to this hobby of following a band around the country---along with not mentally comparing jams to every version you've ever seen and therefore being able to enjoy them more---is that every show gives you a new reason to celebrate. It's my 10th! It's my first time in this time zone! As you stick around, the milestones become rarer; show 60 is an exciting round number but no one can get people to pretend to be interested in 240. However, when you do get them, they're a time to really celebrate.

As anyone who follows me on any social medium knows, 2/25/23---along with being my 100th Saturday show---was my 400th Phish show. The 4th date (if you count the post-midnight segment of 12/31) of the 40th year of Phish gave 400. It was a time for me to reflect, to think about the time and money I've spent (a conservative estimate of an average ticket price of $50 means I've spent $20,000 just on concert tickets alone!). There have been insane adventures. I've met amazing people. It's been the central theme to my everlasting spoof.

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I had an idea to start this review with one-word answers from people about the show walking out of the venue. I gave up on that pretty quickly. Wooks.

In this 40th anniversary year, it’s impossible not to reflect on age, youth, nostalgia, the future.

And it’s an ironic sight to behold when band and crowd, in unison, yell one of the most iconic lines in Phish, “can’t I live while I’m young?!” as we shuffle to and from the show at the all-inclusive resort and wake up with sore legs and tired brains.

So maybe it’s not about living while we’re young. Can’t we live while we’re old?

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[We would like to thank Kelly Wilson, Phishnet user Kellynicu, for recapping last night's show. This site relies entirely on volunteers to recap shows. If you are interested in recapping a summer show that you're planning to see for this blog, please email charlie at phish dot net about which show(s) you'd like to recap (first choice, second choice, etc.). -Ed.]

Here we were again, ready for the first night of Phish in paradise at Riviera Maya Moon Palace. It was an interesting start. With stronger than normal winds here in Cancun, the band opted to postpone yesterday's soundcheck. The winds were quite strong again today, leading phans to wonder if tonight’s show would indeed go on as planned. But in typical Phish fashion, the band made sure the show did in fact go on, and it was nothing short of amazing.

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[Phish.net thanks @andrewrose for this four part reflection on one of Phish's strongest individual tours: Winter 2003. -Ed.]

PART 4: Destiny Refound in the Round Church

Accompanying Playlist

02/28/2003 - Nassau Veterans Memorial Coliseum, Uniondale, NY

Well I didn’t really know what I was getting myself into when I decided to revisit these four shows from 2003, much like I didn’t know what I was getting into 20 years earlier heading out to them. As I sit down to write the last entry on 2/28/03, I’m feeling a little apprehensive that I won’t be able to do justice to this magical performance (or at the very least give it the level of attention as I did to 2/26 in Part 3). It’s actually giving me a fresh appreciation for the band’s ability to show up night after night, especially after a big performance, and try and outdo themselves. It takes a certain kind of stamina and dedication–and let’s face it, a little derangement—to keep it up. And the fact that as I write this the band is about to kick off another year of shows in 2023 is downright mind-boggling. But enough with the disclaimers; this show doesn’t need my entry to solidify its place in the pantheon, any more than it needed that "Mexican Cousin" in the encore. But the question is, does it work anyway? Let’s dive into the finale with Part 4 to find out.

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[Phish.net thanks @andrewrose for this four part reflection on one of Phish's strongest individual tours: Winter 2003. -Ed.]

PART 3: The Moment the Stars All Turned Around

Accompanying Playlist

2/26/2003 - Worcester Centrum Center, Worcester, MA

Alright folks, well if you’ve been skipping class and missed Parts 1 & 2 of this twenty year later trip down Phish-in-February lane, now is definitely the time to sit up and take notice. This is where the memories start to be a little less cloudy for me, and it’s not without reason. Before I dive into the show proper, though, I thought it might be worth sharing a little pre-show memory that could have very easily been nothing but a deep regret.

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[The following post is an interview with Denise Goldman (phish.net user denisegold) about her article, “You Were the Song that My Soul Understood.” The interview is part of an AMA series celebrating the publication of the “Phish and Philosophy” special issue of the Public Philosophy Journal, edited by Stephanie Jenkins and Charlie Dirksen. Denise will also be answering your questions in the comments throughout the week. The next post will feature Kate Aly-Brady, Daniel Budiansky, Adam Lioz, and Rupa Mitra of Phans for Racial Equity, so please submit your questions now.]

Tell us about yourself. Who are you? When was your first show? Why do you come back?

Hi everyone! I am an adjunct professor of freshman writing & research at Long Island University. I teach a class in ethnographic research using this research as a model for my students. I am also a college admissions coach who helps high school students with their college applications. My first Phish experience was at the Boston Garden on 10/30/1992, which was actually Phish’s first time playing the Garden. It was a one-set show which was part of a larger multi-band show. My first official Phish show was at Red Rocks on 6/10/1994. I also went to Big Cyprus, which was one of my most memorable experiences. I identify as a Phish fan and value both the band (who has kept things fresh and exciting for 30 years) and the community (my soul-sisters and brothers) who have made me feel like every show is home.

Why did you decide to write this essay? What do you want your readers to take away from it?

My story is unique amongst the other scholars published in this journal because I was inspired to conduct this research after meeting some Phish “aca-fans” during the Baker’s Dozen, who were joining forces to create “Phish Studies.” At this time, online communities were on the rise and the novelty of “Phish Chicks” really fascinated me. I loved listening to the discourse that was created by women finding other women with whom they connected over the shared love of Phish. Although all discourse communities, including this one, alter over time (with new members coming in), the onset of this community was really a beautiful thing. As I have used this research in my own teaching, I would love for others to take away the same message: discourse communities form from a shared goal for which communication is the conduit for achieving the goal. With that, you see a unique language that forms as well as various genres that satisfy the needs of the members. Since we are naturally drawn to these communities based on our interests, it is important to recognize how we adapt this second language into our daily lives. This research allowed me to develop a curriculum that I use in my teaching and for which I was published in The Journal of the Assembly for Expanded Perspectives on Learning. I believe that a real understanding of your audience allows you to learn how to be a better writer and communicator. While there will always be some controversy that arises within discourse communities, the overall nature of them as well as the learning potential that can be gained from them should be prioritized.

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[Phish.net thanks @andrewrose for this four part reflection on one of Phish's strongest individual tours: Winter 2003. -Ed.]

PART 2: To Think That It Fell From My Hand

Accompanying Playlist

02/25/2003 - The Spectrum, Philadelphia, PA

(Continued from Part 1: How is it I Never Saw?)

After what I thought at the time was a bit of a letdown on 2/24, my expectations were likely more muted coming into the Spectrum, despite it being my first (and last, I think?) show in one of the many ‘hometowns’ we seem to have in the Northeast. Lord knows they’ve played some good ones at The Spectrum (hello Fall 97), and more recently at the Mann in 2015, which comes quickest to mind. And these days you can spot Gritty at just about any show. But the town or venue weren’t super significant to me at the time, and Gritty was just a twinkle in his Fraggle Daddy’s eye; we were city hopping on tour, and I honestly didn’t know what to expect, or which version of the band was currently brewing.

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[Phish.net thanks @andrewrose for this four part reflection on one of Phish's strongest individual tours: Winter 2003. -Ed.]

PART 1: How Is It I Never Saw

Accompanying Playlist

02/24/2003 - Continental Area, East Rutherford, NJ

Well another twenty years have passed, but when you track all the days they’re kind of always passing, aren’t they? Anyway the last time I did one of these (when publishing this retro look at Summer 99 and the Meatstick craze), I laid out what seemed like a necessary disclaimer about the pleasures and perils of nostalgia. It’s still relevant, but this time I’d rather skip that, point you to the footnote, and get down to business—because I have some things to tell you and me about February 2003.

So let’s rewind again, this time back a bit further to the sun coming up at Big Cypress. I didn’t know it then but there would be no “PHISH 2000!” for me. That magical clock turning we did in the Everglades was my last show before the hiatus in 2000, and I had gone off that next summer to do the obligatory European backpack tour with my girlfriend. I turned 20 in August 2000.

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